I just had an in-depth interview with Joshua Spodek on his “Leadership and Environment” Podcast. It’s an hour long!  I particularly enjoyed his serious question toward the end about what is transformative change.  We may disagree.  I couldn’t quite tell.  For example, I said McDonald’s advocating and moving toward sustainable beef is awesome, a big undertaking, and transformative.  I am sure there are those who argue McDonald’s shouldn’t serve beef, and that would be the better transformation.  What do you think?  The same with McDonald’s making the the Happy Meal healthier by adding fruit/yogurt, smaller fries, and soda no longer a default. Others would say that is incremental: why not go organic, or veggie only?

In the interview, I talk about sustainability nirvana as a negative force. Most companies are not going to change overnight to a state of perfection (which varies in the eyes of each stakeholder anyway). I say, why not embrace small and big changes along the way?

Joshua, thanks for drawing out from me my best thinking and challenging me on many topics!